Prime Time Replay:
Dr. Johnston
on the Obsession with Appearances
MsgId: *brain_storm(1)
Date: Fri Dec 20 21:36:20 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.155
Good evening and welcome to Brainstorms. I'm your host, Dr. Keith Harary, Editor at Large of Omni. Our guest tonight is Clinical Psychologist, Dr. Joni Johnston, author of APPEARANCE OBSESSION: LEARNING TO LOVE THE WAY WE LOOK. How much of your self-esteem is related to your looks? Do you exercise for your health or your appearance? Do you overspend on clothes or body enhancement? Is chronic dieting leading you toward an eating disorder? Do you believe that thin is in, youth is priceless and perfection is possible? Join us tonight at 10 p.m. eastern time, for an in-depth discussion with a leading expert on these questions.For clarity, as always, we'll identify ourselves with our initials: KH for Keith Harary and JJ for Dr. Joni Johnston.
KH: Good evening, Dr. Johnston, and welcome to Brainstorms.
MsgId: *brain_storm(5)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:01:14 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
JJ: Good evening, Keith.
MsgId: *brain_storm(6)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:02:31 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
KH: If you don't mind my saying so, Joni, I can't help noticing your picture on the back cover of your book. You are actually quite an attractive woman! Whatever possessed you to write about appearance obsession? Certainly, you are someone who -- it would seem -- would have nothing to worry about in this arena.
MsgId: *brain_storm(7)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:03:55 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
JJ: Keith, I have had women in my office who would give Cindy Crawford a run for her money. These women were agonizing over how they looked. It's a hard thing to realize, I think, but the way we look on the outside has very little to do with our self-esteem and with how attractive we think we are. This is pretty ironic, given the fact that we are told everyday that if we look a certain way on the outside, everything will be all right -- everything will be OK.The reason I wrote the book is that it occurred to me about six years ago that I didn't know a single woman -- including myself -- who really liked the way she looked. I wanted to find out why.
MsgId: *brain_storm(10)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:07:44 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
KH: You mentioned that we are given messages everyday about our appearance and, at the same time, wind up feeling inadequate when we compare ourselves to the ideals we are presented. Where are these messages coming from, and why are they making people so unhappy?
MsgId: *brain_storm(11)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:08:53 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
JJ: Certainly, an easy target is the media. And certainly the media has earned a few bullets. But the reality is that I think the source of these messages is much more complex than that. By the time women especially -- but certainly I think men are beginning to feel the same pressure -- by the time we are teenagers, the most frequent, the most destructive messages we hear about our looks are in our heads. So we know that there is a direct relationship between exposure to ideal bodies, for example, such as reading a lot of fashion magazines or consuming a lot of television, and a negative body image. However, if we took all of those away, I think many of us would still have a struggle because those messages have become so much a part of ourselves. The reason they are making us so unhappy, is because they are impossible to follow and they're not true.
MsgId: *brain_storm(15)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:13:13 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
KH: Well, Joni, did the messages originate in the media or do the media simply reflect our cultural ideals about beauty?
MsgId: *brain_storm(16)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:14:18 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
JJ: That is certainly a chicken and the egg question if I ever heard one! My personal opinion is that I think the media often is a trend-setter, but I do agree that they're setting trends that are often based on political and economic factors. To the extent that they reflect these economic and political trends I think they are portraying what is already there. I think they carry these economic and political trends into the beauty arena.
MsgId: *brain_storm(18)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:17:06 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
KH: Could you tell us a little more about what you mean by "economic and political trends"? It almost sounds as if you are implying that there is some ulterior motive out there, on some level, for keeping us all chasing a certain ideal of beauty? Where is this economic and political pressure coming from, Joni?
MsgId: *brain_storm(19)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:18:12 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.61
JJ: I'm not a proponent of a "beauty conspiracy" theory. However, Keith, when you look, for example, at beauty ideals for women, we do find a direct correlation between periods of political and economic advancement for women, such as the 1920's and again in the 1960's, and the thin-is-in beauty ideal for women. On the other hand, when you have a reversal of that, such as following WWII when women were coming out of the factories and going back into the home and resuming traditional roles, you see a much more voluptuous beauty ideal.In reference to what you were saying about it almost sounding as though there is an economic and political motivation to keep us chasing a certain ideal, I think it would be hard to argue against the notion that keeping us unhappy with our bodies and our looks is big, big business. Whether it's through cosmetic surgery, cosmetics, the diet industry, the latest exercise equipment -- many avenues.
MsgId: *brain_storm(23)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:23:56 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Talk about the chicken and the egg, Joni! It seems that we are in a very difficult position once the ideals have been set in motion. It would seem to be very hard to ignore their siren call. After all, who among us would not like to be considered attractive? What do you see as the downside risk of having a certain ideal to live up to?
MsgId: *brain_storm(24)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:25:35 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: The only ideal I know that works in terms of personal happiness and life satisfaction is making the most of what you have and finding a way to be happy with that. There's nothing wrong with wanting to be attractive, or to be seen as attractive. There are certainly social benefits attached to that. Appearance Obsession, on the other hand, is when a person feels a tremendous pressure to look a certain way but no matter what that person does it is never enough. That begins to interfere with their life in some way. It interferes most often in one of two ways: Either the person avoids doing things that they don't like to do because of their self-consciousness around their looks, or they get caught in this never-ending treadmill of over-exercise, or chronic dieting, or constant weighing -- engaging in self-improvement activities around physical appearance that in some respects dictate their life.
MsgId: *brain_storm(29)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:33:43 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: This makes me wonder, Joni, about where we should draw the line between obsession and normal concern. For example, I have known many very attractive women who have gone in for cosmetic surgery that seemed to me to be completely unnecessary and even detrimental to their appearance. That seems like an obsession to me. On the other hand, I have known many people who are grossly overweight and, it seems, they might benefit by becoming a little more obsessed with their own health and appearance than they currently are. Where do you think we should draw the line in telling people to learn to just feel good about themselves? Does that mean they should get surgery if they think it will help, or stay overweight if they find that easier to live with than dieting?
MsgId: *brain_storm(31)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:36:56 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: Well I do think, Keith, that where we should draw the line is at personal choice. Certainly, cosmetic surgery is a medical procedure and should not be taken lightly. I encourage anyone considering cosmetic surgery to consider three things: 1) Never make the decision while undergoing a personal crisis such as a divorce. 2) Write down and be able to understand what their personal expectations are. If you are counting on a better nose, for example, you might get one. If you are counting on a better life, I recommend you work on your life first and then consider your nose. 3) Regardless of personal decisions around cosmetic surgery, to work on your body image because body image is a state of mind.The other thing I would add to that is that painful body thoughts or negative body feelings often times are a camouflage for other things that are wrong. It's important to look at what is wrong underneath, for example, most people can relate to looking in the mirror one day and either feeling OK with how they look, or at the very least not getting caught up in it. Yet that same person with the same body will say four days or a week later, I was upset about something and I thought either "I feel fat," or "I feel ugly."
MsgId: *brain_storm(35)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:43:20 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Fascinating, Joni. I must add, however, that we not only seem to get messages from ourselves, but also from other people. For example, it seems, many people cannot help but comment on the appearance of those around them -- even telling others that they seem to be putting on weight, or that they look especially tired today, or even asking a woman who is not pregnant if she is currently getting close to labor! Of course, this insensitivity seems cruel or just plain stupid. But it is very common. Does appearance obsession also influence the way people relate to the appearance of those around them? What do you think is going on here?
MsgId: *brain_storm(37)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:47:22 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: There is overwhelming evidence that the more satisfied and comfortable we are with our own looks and our own bodies the more accepting we are of others. So to a large extent, Keith, looks comments from others tell us much more about the messenger than they do about the receiver -- the person on the receiving end. At the same time, knowing that doesn't take away the pain that we can feel when someone makes an insensitive comment about our looks and it is certainly helpful to have a strategy for how to handle this.
MsgId: *brain_storm(38)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:48:54 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Any suggestions, Joni?
MsgId: *brain_storm(39)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:50:41 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: Yes. For example, here we are in the holiday season. One of the most common family activities is what I call a "looks review" where everybody who hasn't seen each other over the past year critiques the other family members. The funny thing about this, I think, is that it happens every year but often we don't have any game plan going into it. But one way to handle it, first of all, is to anticipate and expect it. Have an answer ready before it comes. We can use humor. For example, I know a man who was considerably older than his wife and one of the comments that he often heard was "Is this your daughter" or similar insinuations. He thought it was interesting to respond with, "No. She's my mother."Another strategy can be to level with that person. For example, and I will give an example from my own family, one of the holiday rituals in my family is talking about how many calories or fat grams everything on the table has in it and then negotiating about how you are going to manage to eat everything you want and then skip numerous meals to make up for it! One of the things that we made a rule about in my family was that there was going to be no more talk about calories or fat grams at the dinner table.
My sister and I actually gave some other members of the family feedback about how stressful that was. Of course, we got back the reply that many people get back -- which is "I'm just trying to help." I encourage clients, when you get that response -- and you will -- to just say, "I thought you were. That's why I just wanted to be sure to tell you the impact it had on me."
MsgId: *brain_storm(42)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:53:51 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: When you bring up family situations, Joni, it makes me think about children who are just learning about themselves and developing a sense of their own attractiveness -- or perhaps feelings of inadequacy in that area. Surely, if we as adults are obsessed with our appearance, we must be passing along our obsessions to future generations. Is there any way to intervene?
MsgId: *brain_storm(43)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:54:38 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: Many concerned parents call me wanting to know how they can help their teenagers or pre-teens to avoid having a negative body image or feeling bad about the way they look. My answer is always the same: Role Model. Find a balance for yourself. Let your child control his or her eating. Don't criticize how your child looks. Remember you child will always see what you do and not what you say.
MsgId: *brain_storm(44)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:55:20 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Are there certain warning signs we should all look out for when it comes to appearance obsession in ourselves or those close to us?
MsgId: *brain_storm(45)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:56:12 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: Yes. The bottom line, Keith, is when our feelings about our looks interfere with our life in some way and when no matter what we do we are chronically unhappy and preoccupied with how we look. It's time to get help when that happens.
MsgId: *brain_storm(46)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:57:07 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Do you have any special comments about our widespread obsession with youth? Do you think this will settle down as the majority baby-boomer generation gets older?
MsgId: *brain_storm(47)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:58:36 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: We are already seeing that happen. Ten, fifteen, certainly twenty years ago we would never have seen Lauren Hutton or Goldie Hawn on the cover of a magazine. So, on a positive note, as the population ages we are outgrowing to some extent our preoccupation with youth. The other thing we are recognizing is the fact that age brings so many benefits. I was reading yesterday a study that came out that said the number one predictor of happiness in women was age. The older women got the happier they were.
MsgId: *brain_storm(48)
Date: Fri Dec 20 22:59:20 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Is that because so many of their husbands had passed away?
MsgId: *brain_storm(49)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:00:01 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: Can I refuse to answer on the grounds that the answer might incriminate me?
MsgId: *brain_storm(50)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:00:44 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
KH: Aha. Well, moving right along. I read about another study, recently, that pointed out that most Americans are overweight. For all of our obsessions with dieting and appearance, we seem to be fighting a losing battle. How can that be when the diet industry is booming?
MsgId: *brain_storm(51)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:01:22 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.231.191
JJ: Keith, I personally believe -- and actually there is a tremendous amount of clinical evidence to support this -- that dieting is the number one cause of overeating and weight gain. The more we diet, the more we rely on outside forces to control our eating, the more we are setting ourselves up for overeating and weight gain in the long run. When you look at individuals who develop binge eating disorders, and often other disorders like bulimia, we invariably find that the person began dieting before they began binging. Binging was often a response to starvation.
MsgId: *brain_storm(52)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:01:56 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
KH: So what do you recommend for people who really do feel that they would be happier and healthier losing a reasonable amount of weight?
MsgId: *brain_storm(53)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:02:36 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
JJ: It's important to recognize that there is a huge difference between a weight problem and an eating problem. If someone has an eating problem, that means they are eating in response to many other cues -- not just the physical one that tells us we are hungry. So someone may be eating in response to stress, loneliness, anger, or attractive food advertisements because that person has learned to use food for things other than physical nutrition. For that person, reacquainting him or herself with those physical cues and learning to meet their other needs in more helpful ways is going to be crucial.And yes, that person will probably lose weight as a result of addressing their eating problem. It's also important to realize that there are many individuals who eat normally and have a large body size. Keith, we cannot predict a person's eating by looking at how much they weigh. In that situation, for someone who is eating normally, who is not experiencing medical problems, I personally think that we are the ones who have the weight problem -- or our culture has the weight problem.
MsgId: *brain_storm(55)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:04:00 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
KH: Well, Joni, we're getting to the end of the show. I can only say that I found your book, APPEARANCE OBSESSION, to be very worthwhile and I think the information that you are putting out for people is extremely important -- especially as we are all in the midst of the holiday food orgy season and fast heading into the New Year's resolution diet industry extravaganza in which we can expect to see a lot of ads on television for workout club memberships and various diet plan corporations competing for our dollars. Will we ever learn to see through this annual pattern?
MsgId: *brain_storm(56)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:04:29 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
JJ: I think all of us are becoming more aware of the messages. The hard part is doing something differently in response to them. Maybe one New Year's resolution can be for each of us to treat our bodies as our best friends in 1997.
MsgId: *brain_storm(57)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:04:56 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
KH: Thank you Dr. Joni Johnston for an uplifting discussion. Let me mention that we carry your valuable book, APPEARANCE OBSESSION, in our bookstore of the Omniverse here at our Omni site. Thank you for being a wonderful guest!
MsgId: *brain_storm(58)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:05:29 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
JJ: Thanks Keith, I had a great time. Happy holidays.
MsgId: *brain_storm(59)
Date: Fri Dec 20 23:06:05 EST 1996
From: Keith_Harary_with_Joni_Johnston At: 152.163.237.29
KH: This is Dr. Keith Harary inviting our on-line audience to join us again next week at this same time, here on Brainstorms, for another in-depth discussion with a leading researcher exploring the boundaries of the mind, the brain and human behavior. Good night for Brainstorms.
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